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An SI in the Concordat - GhostRider's Revenants (Battletech CYOA)Rev.2

Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
If she gets back and the falcon still exist its because the council is waiting for her return to make it a proper and clean sweep. More likely she gets home to find she and her forces are the only falcons and can be absorbed or be destroyed. And now the real question become which clan will dare to step up and try to take their place? And what of the wolves because by now they must know their position is increasingly unstable. Falcons and Jaguars are dead. The bears are entrenching and the houses resistance is basically a wall. Retreat or die?
One option is to retreat to the ex-pirate kingdoms, another to the Chainelane Isles, another...
 

Blade4

Apathetic Marine
One option is to retreat to the ex-pirate kingdoms, another to the Chainelane Isles, another...
They can try but with just 2 galaxies probably in increasingly poor repair and what lower castes they got they might not get far before another clan shows up to try and eat or kill them. And another clan will show up because they cant leave what amounts to bandit castes in their backyard near already endangered supply lines. The falcons either survive as a minor clan slowly growing back up or they get absorbed. They dont really have much choice.
 
Chapter 105

Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
Having driven the Jade Falcons out of the Inner Sphere, or at least, out of the occupied Federated Commonwealth territories, the AFFC offensive stopped because it had run out of steam. Most of the WarShips involved were in need of repairs, large ones for most units. The squadrons of ASFs that had supported said WarShips had suffered heavy losses and needed to be replenished. Even though about half of the RCTs involved were still at over 90% capacity, Hanse Davion and Michael Hasek-Davion, were not prepared to begin operations against another Clan without clear superiority in all combat compartments.



While the Steel Vipers had wasted no time in occupying the systems left empty by the Jade Falcons, that the Federated Commonwealth had not liberated, the Wolves and Nova Cats, who also had territory in the Federated Commonwealth occupation zone, had instead withdrawn from some systems, letting most of the systems in direct contact with the AFFC to be owned by the Steel Vipers.

On the Draconis Combine front, the Ghost Bears had followed a similar path, with the Hell Horses taking over several former Smoke Jaguar systems and abandoned Ghost Bear systems, letting them in contact on most of the 'border' with the Combine.

It was clear that some Clans were creating buffer zones with the Inner Sphere to give them enough time to react should further offensives be launched. That other Clans were being used as cannon-fodder was just another proof of their survival of the fittest mentality.

On the other hand, scout missions indicated that several systems in what had been the Oberon Confederacy, the Elysian Fields and the Great Valkyrate were receiving considerable amounts of Clan ships, apparently consolidating their position and according to some analysts, they could be creating a industrial base closer to the current operation zones, making them independent of their more than 1000LY long supply/support line.



On the other side of the Inner Sphere, the Taurian Concordat benefited from contracts to supply both the Draconis Combine and (to a lesser extent) the Federated Commonwealth with military hardware. While from the FC side it didn't receive any Clan equipment, on the Draconis Combine side, not only due to the TDF forces operating in the area (including the Orca raiders), but also because of the agreements with the ruling family, large amounts of Clan material were sent to the Concordat laboratories for analysis.

Although with limited access to Clan material, due to the current cabal against our family, we still received some, but the real gold price was getting access to the blueprints for the first generation of Combine OmniMechs with a direct contract with the two first years of production already bought by the DCMS.



In January 3060, Capellan forces supported by two WarShips CCS Aleisha Kris and CCS Elias Jung, both Feng Huang Class Cruisers, accompanied by Pocket WarShips, Assault DropShips and extra squadrons of ASFs took control of the Andurien worlds of Conquista and Lugartan. The defenders while fighting viciously, had no chance against the more numerous and better equipped Capellan forces. Of interest was that Capellans, used their WarShips to rain heavy orbital fire onto the heavier defenses, a practice more and more common these days, demonstrating that any side lacking WarShips, after losing its ASF component, had very little chance of surviving, much less of winning against even a single WarShip.

It was later discovered that a shipyard was operational in the Capella system, apparently they had rebuilt the old Delhi Warships Shipyard, without anyone discovering it until now, providing House Liao with two shipyards, both capable of building WarShips and JumpShips.



MIM spies inside the Duchy of Andurien reported that the CCAF has deployed native designed battle-armor, and that the organization of the Capellan Hussars had changed, moving into something akin but not like the Taurian Brigades and the Federated Commonwealth RCTs.



While the other ex-FWL provinces, noted with apprehension that the Capellans had started to invade bit by bit the Duchy of Andurien, that wasn't enough for them to try to re-unite against a common foe or to send forces to help against the Capellans, they still considered their neighbors and former friends to be more dangerous. On the other hand, the Canopians had started to very discretely provide the Anduriens with some ASFs and Alamos, models that couldn't be tracked back to the Magistracy, of course. The Concordat, while observing the situation with a growing preoccupation, hadn't yet moved to support the Duchy, but plans were prepared, and forces were moving openly to the area as a not so subtle reminder to the Capellan Confederation that there were lines not to be crossed. Just in case.
 

<Reaper>666

Well-known member
[...]
But it was only in the early 50s, with a company / lab specifically dedicated to the problem and built on Coromodir V, that the first components, smaller and faster than the original ones, started to be produced. Obviously because of the lack of applied researches in this field for centuries, they were fragile and could only be produced at a small scale and were not yet up to the military specs, meaning they could only be used in some places that needed much computer power and were considered safe. Fragile, being for me a very relative term, since by my standards, they were incredibly robust, but by local standards (with BattleMechs lasting hundreds of years), they were fragile and short-lived.
[...]
One problem here - Aurigan Reach by that time is an equivalent of modern Syria or Libya - after the end of the Battletech it is basically a fragmented battlefield and a proxy war between superpowers.
Arano by that point most likely will be dead also.
 

Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
One problem here - Aurigan Reach by that time is an equivalent of modern Syria or Libya - after the end of the Battletech it is basically a fragmented battlefield and a proxy war between superpowers.
Arano by that point most likely will be dead also.
You obviously, have not read/don't remember the rest of the story. The fate of the Aurigan Reach changed a lot from the one of OTL / Lore.
 

<Reaper>666

Well-known member
The clans want to fight one on one - like warriors.
The IS / Taurians want to fight as a unit - soldiers.
Individually, sure, the warrior is superior. In a group - the soldiers massacre the warriors - teamwork is a thing after all.
That concept seems to be flawed, mainly on grounds of assuming that Clans are a Hollywood interpretation of warrior culture and individuality. That was wrong, as Americans have learned during their campaingas against Indian tribes and later on during hunt for Geronimo. The same can be said about British and their African and Asian campaings (Zulus and Afghans). The so called tribal warriors usually turn into infiltration and guerilla doctrine with the use of small units. In case of the Clans, we could assume they are skilled tactitians and passable strategists, whith Inner Sphare having better operational level due to the scale of warfare there, rather the rather limited campaings of Clans (mainly due to the numbers anc regeneration capacity).
Also assumption about monodocrinal approach in the Battletech universe is silly, becouse it assumes that any side is composed from morons and lacks not only intelligence capability, but also basic level of information gathering and analysis. Also Clan invasion was meticulously planned given the size of the undertaking, not some kind of the run out the barracs charge.
Battle of Luthien reads as a typical emphasis on difference of the between pop-cultural warrior and pop-cultural soldier, ie. recreation of Omdurman, but in Battletech verse.
Real fight with the Clans, ie. Clans in the all out war, is a full net centric elite aero-mechanised force of combat pragmatics, with planning and target selection adjusted to the level of opposition.

You obviously, have not read/don't remember the rest of the story. The fate of the Aurigan Reach changed a lot from the one of OTL / Lore.
Partly true - I am digging through your material and try to piece together a coherent picture.
If you could send me or write major differences You have introduced (in bulletpoints), that would be appreciated greatly.
 

Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
Basically, the SI (a Concordat adventurer with the memories of someone from our universe from 2015), get access to the usual datacores - Helm, New Dallas - creates a decent mercenary unit (based on the CYOA rules) with some SLDF Royal tech.
Started to uplift the Concordat. At the time of the HBS game, helped Kame take power and later married her.
The Concordat participated in the Audurien Crisis on the side of the MoC, capturing some CC worlds.
Because of the knowledge of the SI the Concordat gets access to interesting toys, like an HPG and HPG tech, the hardware of the Argo, but not the dropship. Politically, with the removal of the most 'crazy' anti-Davion members from the ruling of the Concordat, the TC is much saner, and Edward starts a de-frozen with the FS and later FC.
The Reach is absorbed by the TC, specifically, with the Arano family in control of the now Aurigan province.
HPG tech is shared with the FC, and the following crisis with Comstar lead to a civil war on Earth, with the proto WoB (without the experience of Tukayyid) going for the FWL, while Earth turns independent - no sane C*.
The clans invade later because of no Outbound Light incident.
At that time, all the IS nations already had warships - some recovered some new and tech-wise are SLDF and moving for Royal level.
FWL has a nasty civil war and fragments.
SJ are destroyed and JF expelled.
The Reach is not only part of the TC but with a modern industry - same for the rest TC, mostly thanks to the efforts of the SI.
The TC is allied with the DC against the clans - don't like the ex-SLDF and can't see an alliance with the FC.
 

Blade4

Apathetic Marine
I am not sure which is more concerning. The clans, some at least, being smart and preparing for a long bloody war or the fact the cappies are being their usual selves and are probably going to keep over reaching till others have to divert troops and resources desperately needed for the clan front to to smack them but not enough to end them. Again. They really need to push the clans now before they can get proper industrial zones going but the Capellans are building up to their traditional tactics of utterly brutal heavy handed invasions then surprised when their enemies are not cowed then get even more heavy handed. The FWL shards are going to have to get their crap together soon or they will just keep getting attacked. They cant possible hate each other more than the fear of being literally enslaved right? Because thats what awaits them.
 

Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
Sun-Tzu is an opportunist, same as in OTL. Sooner or later the ex-FWL is going to awaken, and take some measurer.
Not all the clans are ideologically blinded for all time. Some have smart, pragmatic leaders, and can adapt. Their biggest problem is numbers.
 

<Reaper>666

Well-known member
Basically, the SI (a Concordat adventurer with the memories of someone from our universe from 2015), get access to the usual datacores - Helm, New Dallas - creates a decent mercenary unit (based on the CYOA rules) with some SLDF Royal tech.
Started to uplift the Concordat. At the time of the HBS game, helped Kame take power and later married her.
The Concordat participated in the Audurien Crisis on the side of the MoC, capturing some CC worlds.
Because of the knowledge of the SI the Concordat gets access to interesting toys, like an HPG and HPG tech, the hardware of the Argo, but not the dropship. Politically, with the removal of the most 'crazy' anti-Davion members from the ruling of the Concordat, the TC is much saner, and Edward starts a de-frozen with the FS and later FC.
The Reach is absorbed by the TC, specifically, with the Arano family in control of the now Aurigan province.
HPG tech is shared with the FC, and the following crisis with Comstar lead to a civil war on Earth, with the proto WoB (without the experience of Tukayyid) going for the FWL, while Earth turns independent - no sane C*.
The clans invade later because of no Outbound Light incident.
At that time, all the IS nations already had warships - some recovered some new and tech-wise are SLDF and moving for Royal level.
FWL has a nasty civil war and fragments.
SJ are destroyed and JF expelled.
The Reach is not only part of the TC but with a modern industry - same for the rest TC, mostly thanks to the efforts of the SI.
The TC is allied with the DC against the clans - don't like the ex-SLDF and can't see an alliance with the FC.
You know that in the vast Univers of Battletech such iterative approach is a wishfull thinking? Especially the uplift part? Becouse even over three decades is too small amount of time for the IS to modernise, given their force and power structure? And especially massive overburdened supply chains?
The same goes for warship production becouse even in your scenario by the time of the Clan Invasion you will have at best single digits of prototypes being tested. The domino progress and enlightment theory spreading from Aurigan Reach is not valid becouse the moment they start reorganising and building power, and note they have potential, they will suffer fate of modern Syria becouse they are a destabilising factor IF they allign with one of the neigbouring superpower. In reality scenario end here with similar way as Afghanistan in 1980s - after long time of courting with developement aids by the rival powers, one will invade either openly as humanitarian intervention or peacekeeping when some kind representatives of "Aurigan Alliance" materialise asking for brotherly help or we go good old way of financing expats who have lost power and wealth due to the ongoing changes, which given that Aurigan Reach is de facto a feudal confederation, is more easier. Going the HBS 'verse story or not, that is the outcome, becouse the interstellar strategy and political background is already stacked against any possibility of independent and strong Arano ruled state. Also of note that Aurigan conflict might escalate with standard pattern for conflicts on the borders of sphere of influence. Especially with that local Lostech cache, which might not only lead to the direct intervention of the superpowers but also will likely end with intervention of the Comstar.

Even assuming that will not happen, and we will take a route of you secenrio, we came to the problem of technological spread and modernisation effort.
Battletech universe is not technologically primitive per se - their main problem comes from political power structure and supply chains.
Power structure is feudal, with most models of governance are feudal confederations, with most potent powers havin more centralised structure and greater power of the sovereign.
Supply chain problem steams from centuries of unrestricted warfare, which brings us to the state of broken back theory of warfare. IS and other polities do not actually have problem with hardware nor actually production capability - problem lays in their production, transport and maintanace capabilities which are permamently overburdened and backlogged, especially in case of high-tech components, that is why most of the IS line troops were so much way back technologically and doctrinally behind the Clans and couldn't stop their advance. The same goes for the supply and maintanenece of the civilian infrastructure, becouse of the demand exceeding orders of magnitude production capabilities, not mentioning the transport bottlenecks, all of that in the region of 2 million star systems. Modernisation would include creation from ground up whole new supply chains, science, education, laws, which will all need to be fed with the same amount of resources that barely are sufficient for supplying and maintaining current status. In best case scenario you will end with overtly developed to the level of IS Aurigan reach and spilling that to the periphery of your patron, rest are island and point developements.

Then we came to the military power - IS is mainly aero-mechanised military, with mechs as support or breaking force. Due to the supply and transport bottlenecks and the political power structure, IS powers have relatively small surplus of military power for offensive operations. Each large scale war that came into being was an effect of accumulation of necessary suprlus military capacity - hard to achieve in the broken backed world of Battletech, whcih needs to put considerable garrison forces and supporting them QRF/rapid deployment - 'verse is a universe of permament warlordism, feudal rivalisation and permament subterfuge and subliminal warfare (ie. so called hybrid warfare) - everytime you have large scale conflict or any emergency that eats on your limited military surplus, you are subjected to the chain rebellions, coups and actvation of local warlords, external raids from rival powers and mercenary warfare. Also contrary to the Clans, IS is the ones who are more ritualised at conduct of warfare, due to the delicate balance of power and broken backed world.

In case of Clans, they are mainly mech centered space-mechanised force, due to their numbers and avaiable military technology. Fact that they have managed to for a cohesive politically force and form interstellar invasion which managed to overrun major powers is only a testament to their capabilities. Given their growth enviroment, Clans are more "service guaranees citizenship" model of army society rather than tribal warrior culture. Also they are alone at that time who have real space power with institutional knowledge, interstellar power projection capability and modern, net-centric doctrine, which they use for deadly efficiency. These combined, plus their own history of internal warfare is centered on swift, precision strikes on chosen targets - Clans in war look more or less like SOFs storming building, and on that they excell, not some kind of one-on-one duels. Contrary to the IS, they have relative lack of institutional experiance for waging interstellar campaings, but given the lack of serious opposition at the begining, they will gain it during practice.
Also of note, invasion will be planned. Intelligence, reserves, deep space FOBs forming supply corridors, some cheap spinal modular cargo ships and all that. Also given their doctrine and size, main operating unit of Clan will be an all army independent strike force, which is maximising striking power and self sufficiency. You will have a pinpoint strikes with overwhelming space and air support with drops conducted right on the top of the enemies positions, supported with deep strikes on enemy's C4ISR, supply and communication hubs - BT 'verse does not have "fixed" interstellar routes - jump drives allow for conducting front-less war in whole volume of the operational theathre, and with their space fleet and experiance with using it, they have massive advantage.

It is going to be a return to the full scale, unrestricted warfare. Especially in yours scenario - Clans will be invading with force of greater cohesion with better prepared supply and reserve capabilities and also much more strike force and deep strike oriented doctrine. With IS escalating to the use of nuclear ordinance, all bets are off and we go back to the early Succession Wars unrestricted level of warfare, which will actually benefit Clans more - first they have much greater fleet and institutional knowledge of using it, two have secured industrial base outside the IS reach. Also such scenario will take place mainly in the captured territorry, which encompasess Periphery, which is a place that is treaded by the IS powers as an unrestriced proxy wars site and free fire zones. Arrival of the Clans preaching that they came to restore peace and order, manifesting with pacification of local warlords and stopping meddling of IS, then being subjected to the unrestriced IS raids against Clan FOBs will turn them to the Clanners side, who will gain not only local supprot in form of local basing and supply, but also will gain jannisaries who will make up for the lack of numbers. Also nuclearisation of the conflict will band Clans together becouse now the Clans will be facing (by the way together with Periphery states and populations of conquered territories) a genocidal crusade, a crusade that will mainly take place inside their own and Periphery territories. Also of note is a collapse of o supply chains and convinient FOBs for IS forces due to the previous Clan raids, making power projection to the Clan controlled zone much more difficult.

Also of note is the loss of the mentioned before surplus military capacity which will weaken postition of central sovereings. Copuled with internal dissent, propaganda warfare, mutual distrust and internal disslusionement with new war, and fact that there is an alternative for the feudal reality of IS, mainly Clan meritorcracy, IS will be forced to turn more and more forces and means to the internal stabilisation. With Clan expansion and IS crusade ground to halt due to the exhaustion and overextension, conflict will freeze and we will come to the old an beloved by the IS mercenary and hybrid warfare.

Also with modernisation of the IS and Comstar tech sharing we get a Jihaad.

In no scenario you will have an uniformed SLDF tech IS - only islandisation and more choked supply chains with Clans arriving later with better prepared, more cohesive invasion force, for the new threat, and even more guided by the first strike paradgim - countering imminent future IS invasion of Clans.
Of note is that the new Clan doctrine will look more like "evaluate and strike first" and IS would be "total defense" turning later to the conventional "Search and Destroy".

Also that should be useful as a planning tool.

 
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Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
You know that if you go 'credible' the clans are impossible right?
First, they lose almost all of their limited infrastructure and small population in their civil war.
Second, because of that, they don't have the numbers nor the hardware to rebuild.
Much less the scientists to develop such nice toys.
Don't even talk about the invasion on top of a 1000LY long supply line.

About the IS / Concordat.
The Concordat, which is never at war after the end of the Amaris Crisis, can't rebuild? Right...
In my TL, Comstar is not that omniscient and is destroyed first by the fact that the FC and TC have HPG tech, second their internal civil war led to the radicals going to the FWL - with fewer resources and without the experience of Tukkayyid, and the reformed are absorbed by a new 'normal' Terran/Earth Gov.
If you follow Lore you have a contradiction - on one hand, the IS is rebuilding between the 4SW and the appearance of the clans, but at the same time, much of that is hand-waved because reasons - aka, to force a larger tech difference against said clans.
About half the warships the IS has at the beginning is the IS nations recovering said warships and not Comstar/WoB.
WoB is ground to dust in the FWL civil war.
Almost all the ex-SLDF warship designs (that the clans use) are particularly vulnerable to Alamo decease. And if you take attention to the Ares Conventions, nukes in space - outside of the atmo or 75k of a planet (not sure of each one) are okey-ish.

What I get is an SI that has access to where many of the nice findings are and get then, used then to develop the TC and the Aurigan Reach, while the ROM is busy looking at the IS Great Houses - they don't have unlimited resources after all.
Note that my SI gets the Helm core decrypted, don't need decades to extract the info like OTL.

In the end, you can't apply rational/credibility to the BT universe - too much FASAnomics that are crap. The grow-up / improvement that I used in the TC - is based on the times you need in OTL real world. If you get the tech and have a decent industrial base and resources - and the TC has both, you can grow slow, fast, and faster.
 

<Reaper>666

Well-known member
[...]
About the IS / Concordat.
The Concordat, which is never at war after the end of the Amaris Crisis, can't rebuild? Right...
In my TL, Comstar is not that omniscient and is destroyed first by the fact that the FC and TC have HPG tech, second their internal civil war led to the radicals going to the FWL - with fewer resources and without the experience of Tukkayyid, and the reformed are absorbed by a new 'normal' Terran/Earth Gov.
[...]
That alone means short to medium disruption of the economical and political system on the scale of the whole universum when the sole operator of HPG system goes out of the buisness and supply chains will have to be rearranged. Every one in BT verse has access to the HPG technology, but the Comstar are the sole ones where the main supply and know-how chains end. Growing whole secondary supply chain while being actively sabotaged, (there will be sabotage by the Comstar and others) will take more time than you have alloted - there are no other entities or sources of surplus supply, be it financial, technological or intellectual - whole verse is an equivalent of the post collapse USSR at best day, post USSR withdrawl Afghanistan or Yugoslavia after collapse at worst.

What you can realistiaclly get at best is a slow build up and streamlining to the level of the core Inner Sphere systems due to the deficiency of overburdened supply chains. And permament preventive campaings from higher powers, either through direct military action or the usual hybrid in the gray zone and use of mercenaries/armed expats. That is why real developement times, which are optimised for avaiability of resources and relatively stable geopolitical enviroment fails in a BT enviroment which is basically s-f high tech post apocalypse scenario.
Whole scenario of rapid developement of Arano realms and their fusion with the Taurians is fundamental reason to the HBS story and eruption of the proxy war that would destroy the young state. Your scenario is a casus belli for outrigh invasion, escalating to the conflict with the local powers.

Also note that technological diffusion means nothing here - you can decrypt everything you like but such knowledge is useless as long you do not have production capability and for that you need at best a full control of the whole supply chain, which in the BT universe is very much hard to pull out from known reasons, aside major power blocks.
SLDF level of tech is already on the core wolds of IS, but as I have said before, the main problem of the IS, even without Comstar interference are supply chains and fact that they are not unitary states, but feudal confederations, so you have very visible stratification and technological tierisation throught every administarive level, which makes any fast recovery within 40 or so years impossible. You can arrive to the point that when Clans invade IS has single digit amount of prototype and preproduction models of interstellar warships and might have somewhat easied burden placed on interstellar supply chains, all of which will not matter actually in the greater scheme of things given the scale of the incoming conflict plus the fact that the Clans have, singularly, the best cohesive fighting force among whole major power blocks. And now, due to the changed by You equation, starting not a regime change crusade, but a preventive strike aimed on: distupting the recovery effort, gaining a buffer and puting out or greately weakning two bordering major powers, which will dramatically change the invasion pattern and docrine.

Also main reason for Comstar civil war and Blake Jihaad was tech sharing and upcoming with that loss of power with a bit of religious fundamentalism. That were catalysts. Focal turning point was revaling by the Ilkhan aims on recreation of Star League and uprooting Comstar from Earth and thus ending their monopoly. Tukkayyid was FASA going the noble savage warrior route of explanation, becouse of chivalric tone of the Universe (at least by their intent becouse it is basically nonexistent actually - ie. not felt), rather than Comstar strike force pasting main Clan FOB with much of their forward refit and supplu capacity, together with forward command center when IlKhan was present (which given the Comstar previous support of the Clan invasion and intel capabilities is more than passable).

Removing Comstar from equation will have whole verse wide repercussions together with their Civil War spill out into the net, which can actuall recreate a short term infromational blackout, which will be rectified by the proliferation of HPG You devised but that will take time, time during which all that can start another Succession War actually at worst, at best you look upon gigant economic crisis, universal disrutption of already overburdened supply chains and halting whole modernisation effort as power structure tries to survive the aftershocks, which will benefit more in Your scenario Taurian-Aurigans, but they are too far away to influence the war with the Clans nor Clans are capable nor aim on striking even remotely that far. Plus their combined producation capability and supply chains will even be remotely capable of supporting others powers as US in Second World War.

Building hight tech capabilities and supply chains to support them to somehow sped up universal level of technological restoration in enviroment of know-how regression, overburdened supply chains, constant warfare, sabotage and broken-back islandised civilisation is extremely difficult, even night impossible if we throw in preventive war paradgim. That is saying nothing about fast restoration on the universal scale, even despite greater coherence and centralisation of the larger powers, which have proportionally greater geostrategic problems and expenses to cover from extremely limited resources.

And cursory, Ares Conventions:

 

Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
Funny, because a few years late in OTL, by the time of the FC Civil War, all the tech/gadgets I used in late 50 are present. Including many warships. I 'just' accelerated things about a decade.
Also, by 3052 - Tukayyid / Operation Scorpion - is demonstrated that not only several nations can capture HPGs but also operate them without problems. I give them the tech earlier. Note that both TC and FC/NAIS get not only a fully SLDF class A operational HPG to learn from but also the manuals, blueprints, and theory.
Also, one of the first passes I take is to repair/rebuild civilian shipyards - takes a decade and a lot of money - to produce more jumpships.
If you see the Ares Conventions you added the link, you see that the use of Alamos in space (not near a planet) is covered and considered ok. And is all that is used against the clans. Only in the ex-FWL civil war atrocities are committed (WoB lunatics present).
For a reason I used New Vandenberg for the initial progress/development - is one of (if not the most) the most industrialized worlds in the Periphery - even comparable to many advanced ones in the IS.

If I understand correctly, much of your point is that the access to resources/supplies makes what I have done not possible. That, and the immediate targeting from bigger nations.
I say that ITTL the bigger nations are distracted with IS affairs and don't see what happens until is too late - that includes C*.
And about resources - I used one of the most industrial developed worlds in the TC, with a repairable shipyard, and also make use of the Snowden to get access to more resources - ann in one system, not need many jumpships until later.

Is stretching things a bit? Probably, but the original universe doesn't make sense from an industrial/economical point of view. Even has a post-apocalyptical one. That is only true for early 30xx, btw.
 

Blade4

Apathetic Marine
Sun-Tzu is an opportunist, same as in OTL. Sooner or later the ex-FWL is going to awaken, and take some measurer.
Not all the clans are ideologically blinded for all time. Some have smart, pragmatic leaders, and can adapt. Their biggest problem is numbers.
Indeed. Again the best thing is not fighting a power that has planets with more people than your entire clan but if they insist... They need all the clans working together or individual clans will just end up like Falcons and Jaguars but if some brave clans want to stick their face in the grinder for glory while the smart ones build up to something in near space that might be able to give the revitalized houses pause well the smart clans will thank them for their sacrifice then absorb the survivors and assets later. The houses cannot let the clans move in or get their logistics in order or it just makes the grind even worse. The problem lies in what happens after they kill the first set of invaders and a next set just keeps coming with fresh troops and even more warships they are hard pressed to stop? But what happens when the clans on the front lines realize they are caught in death ground and the ones behind them eventually realize invasion means your clan dies?


The problem they literally cant afford is Sun-Tzu getting emboldened by each success thinking he can leverage threats and warships the surrounding houses simply cant afford to deal with grabbing what he can till he finally crosses a line and the FedCom and FWL shards simply soak the blood and deal with him. Canon Sunny had plot protection and crossed all kinds of lines without going to far but here it is more likely he will go mad himself eventually.
 
Chapter 106 New

Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
Between mid 3060 and late 3062, the conflicts on the various fronts were little more than light raids / reconnaissances "en force".

One of the reasons was that all participants were busy repairing / refitting WarShips, in order to give them better defenses against attacks from ASFs loaded with Alamos.

On the Draconis Combine front, by late 3060, the Taurian Concordat had rotated its forces. Three new brigades of Taurian Guards had replaced those hitherto on the Clan front, and among the replaced WarShips had been dispatched the TCS Amanda Calderon a modified Soyal class Heavy Cruiser (see chapters 40 and 51), which had meanwhile been converted to a Heavy/Fleet Carrier, after extensive trials had resulted in the decision to remove the Medium Mass Driver and take advantage of the space to increase the ASF force to 72 units, with abundant fuel, spares and ammo.



The 11th Taurian Guards Brigade faced the Hell's Horses in Nykvarn in March 3061, in the biggest battle of these period, defeating the 12th Mechanized Cavalry Cluster, part of the Alpha Galaxy, and capturing the heavily damaged CHH Gold Knight (a Lola III class Destroyer). The Taurians superior number of ASFs, the presence of the TCS Amanda Calderon, as well as the large number of Battle Armors - more than twice as many as the Clanners had locally - contributed to this victory, even though several new BA models - including some up to 1,500kg (Rhino and Gnome) - deployed by the Hell's Horses were an unpleasant surprise.



The fact that for the first time, a Clan used AAMs, and in great numbers, was a warning of what the future would be. On the positive side, the Taurians captured models of the new BAs and the AAMs used by the Hell's Horses, which they immediately sent to the Concordat for analysis.

The TMI finalized the re-deployment of the HPG satellite network that connected the Concordat to the Combine in March of 3061. All satellites were moved to other uninhabited systems and at same time, replaced by more modern models, with improved stealth, anti-tampering protections, and longer duration fission reactors. As the Concordat suspected, some had been tampered by the Federated Commonwealth, to let them listen to the traffic between the Concordat and the Combine.



In the Coromodir system, although it was not possible, for the moment, to build a shipyard, a large dockyard was taking shape around Coromodir V, equipped with a dozen slips and able to service the Concordat largest civilian and military ships. A smaller one is in construction in the Detroit system, planned to be operational by 3065.



In 3061, both Jaime Wolf and Natasha Kerensky retired from active service, due to their advanced age . Jaime was replaced in overall command by Mackenzie Wolf and Natasha by Maeve Wolf, who promptly changed the name of the unit to Wolf Spider Battalion.



The Wolf's Dragoons had the same problem as other nations that had ex-SLDF warships - they had to upgrade them with defenses against ASFs. However, Outreach was lacking a shipyard, and the Federated Commonwealth had theirs occupied for a very long time, meaning they had to turn to my family.

This explains why in late 3061, the WDWS Alexander (Aegis class) docked onto the shipyard at Mechdur, for a refit. The other Wolf's Dragoons WarShips were to be modified one at a time, so as not to overload the shipyard, which already had a long list of orders. The quid pro quo for such a service remained secret for some time.



On September 12, 3062, Takashi Kurita passed away, being officially reported to have died in his sleep.

On October 22, 3061, Dalma Humphreys, the Duchess of Andurien escaped an assassination tentative. The assassins were stopped at the last minute by MIM agents that had been ordered by the Magestrix to protect the Duchess.

The assassins, later identified as Death Commandos with cyborg-like enhancements, were defeated by the PA(L)s of the MIM agents. Unfortunately (for the Magistracy), they couldn't hide their presence in the Duchy of Andurien any longer.



Having their two last WarShips finally repaired and refitted, the Marik forces used them, with a massive escort of ASFs, Assault DropShips and Pocket WarShips to renew the war with Oriente.
 

Blade4

Apathetic Marine
The idea of Natasha retiring sounds absurd. Wolf maybe but Natasha would rather find a large enemy pile and wade in... Fedcom will probable have diplo issues with tampering with those hpgs but not like anything can be done about it right now but it will haunt relations. Nykvarn will probably be studied by both sides a long time for both ground and space battles. A battle where BA was a major factor is pretty rare. And the clans will probable learn from this first attempt with aam. The dragoons might be better keeping those ships mothball or selling them. They just dont have the resources to keep them going or even trying to fix them if they do take any kind of real damage but we shall see how it goes.

And "death commandos" with cyberwear... Blakists getting more blatant?
 

Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
The Wolf Dragoons are not permitted to go fight the clans ITTL, they are used by all nations that fight said clans to train their forces. So, for Natasha to go find a fight is a bit difficult. At least as a Dragoon. Nothing is said about where she goes after retiring from the Dragoons, however.

The assassins are legitimate Death Commandos. If some last blakists get to the CC and provide some tech is an option.
 

Blade4

Apathetic Marine
Sun-Tzu is pushing in very dangerous ways. knock off cappie domni is rather terrifying. And I bet Natasha is finding her way to the front to fight somewhere. She cant go back to the wolves given her age. They would never let her test out for warrior. And no Falcons do kamikaze against either with her sibmate. She might be rather sad about all this.
 

<Reaper>666

Well-known member
Funny, because a few years late in OTL, by the time of the FC Civil War, all the tech/gadgets I used in late 50 are present. Including many warships. I 'just' accelerated things about a decade.
Also, by 3052 - Tukayyid / Operation Scorpion - is demonstrated that not only several nations can capture HPGs but also operate them without problems. I give them the tech earlier. Note that both TC and FC/NAIS get not only a fully SLDF class A operational HPG to learn from but also the manuals, blueprints, and theory.
Also, one of the first passes I take is to repair/rebuild civilian shipyards - takes a decade and a lot of money - to produce more jumpships.
If you see the Ares Conventions you added the link, you see that the use of Alamos in space (not near a planet) is covered and considered ok. And is all that is used against the clans. Only in the ex-FWL civil war atrocities are committed (WoB lunatics present).
For a reason I used New Vandenberg for the initial progress/development - is one of (if not the most) the most industrialized worlds in the Periphery - even comparable to many advanced ones in the IS.

If I understand correctly, much of your point is that the access to resources/supplies makes what I have done not possible. That, and the immediate targeting from bigger nations.
I say that ITTL the bigger nations are distracted with IS affairs and don't see what happens until is too late - that includes C*.
And about resources - I used one of the most industrial developed worlds in the TC, with a repairable shipyard, and also make use of the Snowden to get access to more resources - ann in one system, not need many jumpships until later.

Is stretching things a bit? Probably, but the original universe doesn't make sense from an industrial/economical point of view. Even has a post-apocalyptical one. That is only true for early 30xx, btw.
"Accelerating" seems to be a more than bit of the handwave, given the original needed - one, the Clan invasion and completely one sided slaughter of the IS forces, two, direct assist of the COMSTAR with the overhaul of the necessary infrastructure - ie. resources, skilled manpower know-how, three, IS wide militarisation of economy, and four, creation of the Second Star League - which from them the last is actually of utmost importance becouse it brought the common political platform for solving de facto organisational and supply matters. Second most important thing was the COMSTAR changing sided to the IS becouse with that Clans have lost their main trup card - sccess to the miniute advance information the COMSTAR was providing them from the day one - which, combined with their space superiority and restorative mandate let them such a quick advance and capability to crave throught the oposition. Without all these simultanously enacted and about a decade of consolidation and build up, under one common political platform, wartime mobilisation, direct support with point overhaul of critical infrstructure. Recreation of the Star League and temporal alliance have freed much of the resources and supply chain capability to be used for mobilisation and to focus on the common threat. Of course ofter stagnation and repulsing the Clans all that went to the sink, but without that the rebuilding of the capabilities would be not possible.
The IS have had much of the capabilities thought lost but they were too much spread and engaged in the permament back log for sustaining the then current level of comitments in an enviroment of the permament warfare and internal instability (hence pseudo-feudal system - personal loyality was more reliable rather than other conventional means), which actually makes sense on the warlordist universe of Battletech). Best example is introduction into the warfare by IS infantry powered armour within the year after the invasion of the Clans. Technology and production capability is there but ot can be leveraged in the extraordinary circumstances at the cost of the other, just like in typical mass mobilisation scenario and militarisation of the economy, things that were implemented by the IS due to the life threating event the Clans were.
The same goes for the warships. The IS IS CAPABLE of building a fully capable warship with the means and forces it has. The largest powers can. True that is. But trying to do that will take the necessaty production capability an supply and skilled labour that is crucial for sustaining your current level of the commitments. At least when we are talking about true interstellar capable warships, becouse gunships like converted assault dropships or non jump capable ones are within the reach of their capabilities and actually utilised. Also given their level of commitments and support capability and the area the main powers need to maintain their preseance, true interstellar capable warships are redundant or luxury that actually is not as efficient given the cost-effect analysis.
Clan invasion is changing that becouse the IS is once again set up into the interstellar all out war, something that they actually didn't have experience to wage. Tech level of the Clans actually is here irrelevent, per se, what is of main interest is the fact the the Clans have fully stoceked and capable armed forces with fully functional equipement, rhater than downgraded shells the, mind that, usual line troops of the IS have - it is the Clans who have fully staffed and equipped armed forces in combined aero-mechanised format together with real space forces, which gives them both strategic and operational advantage, massive and multiplied by the infomational near omnisicence, courtesy of the COMSTAR.
IS aside the Clan specific hard -, soft ware and capabilities, have access to the same actually, but in much smaller quantities. What usually is a standart for the line Clan formations, it is found only in Guard and Elite regiments of the IS, becouse large powers of the IS only have so avaiable capacity to field and support it in miniscule quantities. The same goes for actually everything else considered high-tech and critical for warmaking capability. Most of the Battletech universe, with translation to the modern aircraft, runs in the quivalents of the Fiat G.91 and F-4s when the standard Clanner in Su-35S.
The reason as to why Clans were beated, was aside what I have written in the begining, and authorial fiat of the lore creators, overexension and mounting losses, which made their capability for maintaining gained space not mentioning recreation of the Star League impossible, and in the second case, moot , becouse IS have formed it itself. Nevertheless given the war exhaustion and internal differences have prevented the further unification and reaching permament resolution of the Clan problem, which by itself also seem to validate claim of the severe partition of the critical industrial capacity and capability of the IS economy.
 

Paulo Brito

Well-known member
Author
ITTL Comstar is ended/fragmented years before the clans appear. Also, tech renaissance, including warship production existed before the clans appear. Part is caused by the SI getting the fully decrypted Helm DataCore and New Dallas DataCore, and many of that is shared/obtained by the other nations.
While one of the advantages in OTL the clans have is warships, ITTL, the waves of ASF loaded with Alamos is already an effective counter to them.
Yes, the clans still have more advanced tech, but when they appear, the FC, DC Terra, and TC are at SLDF / SLDF Royal level production level.
The tech imbalance is smaller, the IS already has BA and experience fighting it, some warships, and the clans don't have Comstar helping them.
On top of that, much of the industrial upgrading in the Is has already been done and the land industrial capabilities and numbers are meh compared to the IS ones. Add the fact that they are at the end of a thousand light-years supply line, which also add delays to receiving support/reinforcements, and adapts to the new techs the IS show.
Like I said in my initial post, is a different universe in the late '50s, than the one of OTL.
 
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